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Anonymous #1977
>the modern FIM community is now primarily twitter and tiktok zoomers who grew up with the show as opposed to autistic old fags in their 30s

Well it was fun while it lasted
heart04winds

@Zaknel
you know that's pretty fuckin hilarious from someone who used to hang with 4channers and in fact posted Aryanne not once


not twice


but three bloody times




and that's only what I could find reposted here, I would not be surprised if he has a folder full of bloody Aryanne on his PC somewhere xD
Anonymous #E317
This just sounds like a bunch of butt-hurt "It's my civil right to be hateful" bs.
Anonymous #1462
@Osha

I'm perfectly willing to drop the 100% pure free speech strawman, because it's just hard to tell where people are coming from some times. Some people see a slippery slope and are cautious of censorship, some people legitimately believe that speech shouldn't have any moderation whatsoever. The former people tend to be more reasonable. I generally think edgy humor is fine, but there does come a point where people use humor as an excuse to obfuscate some pretty cringy beliefs. I don't think that's happening here (that I've seen at least), but I've certainly seen it in other places. I actually recall a youtuber that was outed for blatantly racist comments he made on his discord, which he blew off as "haha lol that's jokes don't take me so seriously". I decided to prod the comment section for the video where he says this, and sure enough I did find people coming from the floorboards to defend both racism and fascism. I'm going off on a tangent though, and I should reiterate that I don't really see that being the case here specifically.

As far as the slippery slope, I don't really know what all the people running derpibooru did, so it may very well have been quite the awful slippery slope. I'd imagine that they probably could have accomplished whatever they were setting out to do in a much more responsible and diplomatic way, but again, I'm not as familiar with that whole mess as I might like to be. I do think that it's worth making large online spaces more inclusive and more comfortable for people of all sorts (except for like pedophiles and like people who legitimately believe people should be killed off or enslaved or shit like that), but I am of the mind that there's a balance to be struck betwixt inclusiveness and freedom, and it's a difficult balance to maintain in a world that's constantly changing and moving forward.

When you say that if limits are to be applied, they should be applied to both sides, then I could agree with that to a point. I'll admit that I'm a bit of a lefty so there's some bias there, I think the BLM movement is important, but if derpibooru is defending people promoting violence against white people or cops or defending the promotion of vandalism and stuff, then I'm vehemently against that. If they're going to ban the promotion of violence, then indeed they should ban that on both sides if they're to do so at all.

I also appreciate that you took the time to have this back and forth with me in a pretty civil manner. I was legitimately curious and a bit concerned, and I'm glad you took the time to provide your perspective and explain the situation a bit, so thank you for that.
Osha
Liberty Belle - Sings the song of the unchained

Occasional Artist
@AnonymousTheGreat

I don't believe that most of the people who have voiced their concerns are calling for "100% pure free speech", and I would appreciate dropping this strawman. Death threats and personal attacks against users shouldn't be okay. But if you want to start coming after content that makes edgy jokes or whatever, you need to have a damn good reason, and Derpibooru did not have a damn good reason. The reason you don't see people here saying "nigger jew" left and right is because being able to say these things isn't why most people here are leaving Derpi, we are simply concerned about the precedent that it sets to start retroactively deleting art because it made some people uncomfortable.

Inb4 Slippery Slope. It's not a fallacy if the slope can be observed. And even if we couldn't show it, how is it any more of a slippery slope to say "censorship doesn't stop at one" than it is to say "if you let people speak their mind minorities might be sad :("? Obviously we don't want people running around random comment sections calling each other slurs (and admittedly, a more developed rule0 policy than "Don't be a dick" may be useful), but I cannot support banning content that might hurt a feeling. There's tons of crap out there that I don't like, and I don't complain about it ruining Derpi/Pony/Whateverbooru because I know how to use filters. This was always the solution on Derpibooru to avoid having to deal with stuff you don't like, and I fail to understand what exactly the problem was with that.

If, or when, Ponybooru staff decide to place limiters of what can be said, they need to be careful that they do so fairly. Make this shit apply to both sides — if you want to see an example of what I'm saying not to do, simply go to Derpi forums and see how desperately the staff is trying to defend "promoting violence" against certain groups of people while banning content that's "promoting violence" against others. I don't agree with banning any of it, so long as it's not targeted at specific people, but there needs to be no bias here.


Either way, for what it's worth, I do appreciate you taking your time to voice concerns. It can't do anything but help the site if you convince staff to think about these things, which puts you leagues above those who would rather see any of these altboorus fail simply because they aren't DERPIbooru.
Anonymous #1462
@Osha

I don't believe in silencing people and just eradicating all dissent, but I am of the opinion that, say, a well written TOS can do a lot of good. I think that tends to weed out people that do indeed want to shove out smaller groups, whether those smaller groups be people of certain ethnicities, religious beliefs, or what have you. And, y'know, people that would legitimately advocate for genocide and the like. These large groups don't really need to be the people in charge, they just need to be, well, large. In an perfect world we can have 100% free speech because the people that want these things just don't exist. We don't live in that perfect world, which is why free speech, not so unlike the free market, is at its most free when there's a bit of moderation to keep things running smoothly. Now, I don't plan to nuke this platform, because I don't see the need and that does sound like a lot of effort. I don't think this place is some nefarious nazi safe haven. I mostly say this because in this reasonably sized comment section I, indeed, haven't seen anyone say the n word or make a holocaust joke or talk about how the SJWs or libtards really got their asses handed to them. I also think there's more to this ponybooru derpibooru divide that I haven't seen, considering I wasn't there for it. I just think it's important for people to understand that, while pure free speech is an admirable goal, there are caustic elements that are more than happy to take advantage of pure free speech, and they won't just go away unless they're removed from the platform or their goals are made difficult to the point of their effort no longer being worth it.

@Officer Hotpants

I would argue that you don't really need to call for suppression of speech to suppress people. I think all you really need to do so is a space that's hostile to a marginalized group. Now, I won't pretend to belong to a marginalized group, so I won't pretend to know what it feels like to, for example, be a black person in a space where every other word is in reference to what slaves, property, were referred to as. I'm gonna go ahead and assume though that seeing the dehumanizing term for your race so often makes a place feel pretty unwelcoming. Then again, I don't know for certain, and it's unfortunate that people that throw such terminology around also don't take into consideration that, they too, don't know how it feels (although I can imagine that people with less pleasant beliefs may have a good idea of how it feels, which is why they use the term so freely). Now I'm not saying that this place is so unwelcoming, but rather I'm making the argument that speech, 100% free and unmoderated, inherently comes at the cost of the free speech of marginalized groups that can effectively be shoved out by larger groups. This effect is, admittedly, seen far more severely in some spaces than it is in others (often considering differences in moderation and demographics. I'd like to think that people getting off to ponies tend to be less shitty than most other people.)
hianon
Liberty Belle - Sings the song of the unchained

Let's all love Lain
I don't think that article did anything, it's just that the Great American Gorilla Chimpout was a call for action to leftists around the globe that they can push further their agenda and no one would notice due to being overwhelmed.
Officer Hotpants
Rampant Stag - A swift sidekick
A toast - Incredibly based
Officer Shid pants - Hi, Im a lil shid.
Chatty Kirin - A user who has reached a combined 1000 forum posts or comments.
Liberty Belle - Sings the song of the unchained

Assistant
Double-0 Negative
@AnonymousTheGreat
They actually have already started demanding DB ban more stuff now. As for "using speech to suppress other people's speech", that's not a thing. Unless you mean using it to call for the suppression of speech. That certainly happens and always will. It's the modern expression of the primitive human instinct to hit the other caveman until he shuts up. It's an immediately self-defeating proposal, though. It also carries the benefit of immediately outing those who call for such suppression for the little would-be tyrants they are. And as I've said before about numerous subjects: if people want to loudly out themselves, let them.
Osha
Liberty Belle - Sings the song of the unchained

Occasional Artist
@AnonymousTheGreat

The desire to silence other people is an idea that should always be resisted, be it in defense of either left, right, or grill-leaning peoples. That is the point of this. The people here are (at least overwhelmingly) against banning communism themed content just like they're against banning Nazi themed content.

I don't wish to see any people be suppressed, but, frankly, there is no such thing as being marginalized when it comes to a platform where you can trade ideas, unless one side becomes thumbed upon by the people in charge. I'm hoping the staff here has learned by Derpi's mistake that being biased as such is a huge mistake. But if some people saying zigger or making holocaust jokes is something you don't want to see on a platform that is completely willing to let you speak your mind, the answer to that problem is not "run away and nuke the platform from a safe distance". It is the fault of neither pro-expression users or the site staff if this is what you decide to do.

You entirely have the right to engage these people, the same as they can with you. It's best for both sides to be civil, obviously, but until people learn how to get the fuck over scary words, every community will end up as an echo chamber for either side of the isle. Which is a fate I want stopped in it's tracks, so we can go back to just having fun again.